Interview with Bright Eyes

Dave: I'm Dave Corey, and you're listening to Joe's Blue Plate Special. We're backstage with Conor Oberst of Bright Eyes.

Conor: Hey, Dave. Thanks for having me on Joe's Blue Plate Special.

Dave: Thanks for coming on the show. As your music tastes changed from the more aggressive sounds of Commander Venus to what you're doing now, do you miss playing more aggressive music?

Conor: I do a little bit. Actually, I just started a rock band a couple months back. We don't have a name or too many songs yet. We got about five songs, but just playing with some dudes in Omaha. So, yeah, I still like to play loud music and stuff. But even back then I kind of listened to a lot of different stuff, like softer stuff, back then. And now I still listen to the hard stuff, you know what I mean, so it's sort of like just both things I've always had an interest, I guess.

Dave: Cool, cool. In the 90's Grass, you put out your first album, Seemed To Be The Next Amphetamine Reptile, but they kind of quickly faded and changed their name. Do you think that they did a good job with your first group, and has Saddle Creek treated you well?

Conor: Yeah, it's funny that you know about Grass, 'cause a lot of people forgot about 'em. But Grass was a label that had a lot of good bands, I thought. They had like Brainiac and the Wrens. Actually, the reason we kind of found out about 'em is they had this band from Omaha called Mousetrap that was really great, so we liked all the bands, and we were really excited when we signed to 'em, but then pretty much right after we signed to 'em, they went through that big change and they got bought out and they turned into Windup Records, which is now like Creed's label and all that shit. So it was basically the label we thought we were signing to and the label that actually was the label once we had signed were completely different, and it caused a lot of discrepancies and made it so that...I will say for Windup they treated us really well, even though we weren't a band that could possibly sell records or anything like that, but they were good to us, so I'll give 'em that, but, yeah, I kind of mourn the loss of Grass. I think they had a lot of good bands, Sun Brain and a lot of bands. As far as Saddle Creek goes, that's been the label that us and our friends have always run together, so I guess they treat us well, but it's sort of like ourselves treat....

Dave: ____________ treat yourselves right....

Conor: ...right.

Dave: This is not even on the page here, but I'm gonna ask you, just since we're on the subject of Saddle Creek, how has it been running your own label and putting out other people's music?

Conor: It's been great. I mean, the whole idea that was all the bands that are on it pretty much help run it. We have this one friend Rob that, he was in Commander Venus but now he doesn't play in any bands, and he does the day-to-day stuff, but we all sort of help out and make kind of decisions together, and so it's really awesome because it's like, it's something that we do as...unfortunately, even though we'd like to kind of branch out and deal with more bands that maybe we're not so good a friends with, we just haven't really found any that have worked out or whatever, and so luckily we have like this big group of friends and a lot of great songwriters that we just know, and I feel really good about supporting all of them and kind of trying to stay together as like a group. I think that makes it better for everyone.

Dave: Cool, cool. How is being from Omaha affected your music? Were you influenced by old bands like Say No More, or did you develop mostly outside of the local...

Conor: Well, I wasn't too into Say No More, I guess they were before my time, I don't know. I didn't listen to too much of them, but definitely Omaha has had a big influence. There's a guy Simon Joiner from Omaha, he was a huge influence on me, not only as him being a great songwriter but also just a great person, a great role model as far as how to operate with integrity in doing your music, but also I think Omaha is just cool 'cause it's really supportive. It's like there's enough going on to keep it exciting, but it's not like a place like, I don't know, this is the only I've ever lived, but I imagine a place like Chicago or New York, it's kind of like a lot of competition, you know, people trying to kind of cut each other down or be the next big thing. In Omaha, it's not really like that. It's more like everyone goes to the shows, 'cause if not everyone went, then there wouldn't be anyone...you know what I mean? It's like there's not enough people to cut each other down. It's like, you want everyone to be into it and playing and making stuff, 'cause that's really what we want, is more art coming out of the Midwest and out of Omaha.

Dave: So is it a pretty supportive scene?

Conor: Yeah, definitely. I mean, it goes through ups and downs because it's hard to keep a steady club going in a place as conservative. I mean, it's an insurance, like cattle town at its core, but there's a little niche of people that are doing really cool things, not only music but art and plays and poetry, whatever, and it seems to be getting better, so that's a good thing.

Dave: Great, great. How do you normally compose songs? Do you write on guitar or piano?

Conor: Both I guess when it comes to putting the chords down and stuff. Normally how the songs start is like usually with a vocal melody or some kind of few like lines of lyrics with like a melody that I kind of keep repeating in my head for a couple weeks, and then once they've sort of stuck around and I realize that they're not going away, then I sit down and like put chords to 'em, either with guitar. I've been trying to do it more with piano, but I'm a really terrible piano player, but I'm practicing and improving hopefully, slowly, so I'm looking to do more piano-based songs.

Dave: Uh huh. And how 'bout for your lyrics?

Conor: Lyrics? Like I said, there's usually a few that sort of come like right with the melody or like right when the song is sort of whatever, born in my head or something, and then after that, it becomes more of like cognitive where you set down to write the rest of the words and that's where it becomes more of like a craft of like how am I gonna arrange these words to have it be the most effective and get across the feeling that the song is, you know, which is obviously the most important part, but there's a good bit of thinking that goes into it sort of after the initial push or whatever.

Dave: Your lyrics are emotionally charged and very directed at past relationships in some cases. It seems now that your record is getting out, do you find that hinders getting involved with people?

Conor: Sometimes. It's hard to meet people that know you from your music, you know, which happens to me a good bit traveling. It's just, obviously the music comes out of you and it's a big part of you, but it doesn't fully encompass who you are entirely, you know, especially with the music we make, a lot of it's kind of downcast or whatever, and yeah, that's part of me, that's stuff I'm dealing with or whatever, but I still like to joke around and laugh and have fun and get fucked up and just have a good time, and it's like a lot of times people meet you and they expect you to be the exact person from your songs, and I'm not always that person, you know. And when I am that person, I'm usually not wanting to hang out with people, you know? So it's like it's a little bit difficult, and it does make for some awkward situations of people expecting you to be one way and then you being something that they're not...or different somehow, so...

Dave: Yeah, especially with like your relationships. Has that been difficult to meet girls and things like that?

Conor: Yeah, I'm still looking for my special girl, but, yeah, I definitely have had a lot of failed attempts, and my rule is kind of to try to not ever start a relationship based off someone I would meet just through music, but I guess it's happened a couple times, and it hasn't ever worked out yet. I mean, maybe that's a big like overall policy to have all the time, but I don't know, I guess I want someone that's into me more than they're into my band, you know? And...whatever.

Dave: Cool, cool. Watching you live, it seems that your songs take on a very physical state for you. You look like you could come undone at any moment, at least that's what I've noticed, but by the end, you seem moire controlled and empowered. Are you typically exhausted at the end of a set?

Conor: Yeah. Actually, it really helps me to play a lot of times because...well, before we play, typically like for an hour or two before we start, I get kind of sick, kind of like anxious...actually, this tour has been kind of bad 'cause I haven't been like drinking as much, which is a good thing for my body but bad for my nerves and stuff, because I've been getting like these sort of like my throat feels like it's closing up...it's just really weird, and I feel like, oh god, I'm getting really sick. I've said that to these guys a couple times. I'm like, I don't know, I'm getting really sick or something, and then we play and about halfway through the set I start to feel a lot better, and then by the end of the set, it's like I'm tired but I'm like totally feeling way better. It's like a big relief and everything's sort of out. It's been really helpful to me actually lately, so...

Dave: Cool, cool. Would you say that that's symbolic of your personal life at all? Does that occur in your personal life as well, or is mostly just a band thing?

Conor: What's that?

Dave: Let's move on. I don't know what I'm trying to say there. With the sudden rediscovery of Nick Drake in the American music media, do you predict that a lot of singer/songwriters of that ilk are going to emerge?

Conor: Yeah. I think that it's sort of...obviously, it's been something that's been around since the beginning of time, you know, and it's probably reached different high points and low points throughout the years. Sometimes it's not cool to sing about your feelings, sometimes it is, but it doesn't matter, 'cause everyone's always gonna keep doing it, you know. But I just hope that a lot of...'cause there's a lot of great songwriters that aren't getting the recognition they deserve, and I hope they, you know, like you said, like a lot of older music right now is starting to kind of become popular again, and I think that that will lead to, hopefully it will lead to people taking a little more time and crafting like better songs, or at least appreciating those who do craft songs well, you know. That's my hope. I don't if it'll be the case.

Dave: If it will actually come true. What's the most outrageous thing you would do or have done for money?

Conor: I can't talk about that, Dave, I'm sorry. I don't know if that would be appropriate for radio.

Dave: For our listening audience. Okay. As you put out records and progress musically, do you feel pressured to outdo yourself from record to record or to satisfy old fans while attracting new fans?

Conor: I try not to let those things really enter into the way I write songs. Now granted there's a bit that is gonna seep in, like subconsciously I'm much more aware of there being an audience now than I ever was before. Like before it was like I just wrote songs and it never occurred to me that anyone was going to be listening to them, you know. And now it's like, that's impossible. It's like I know people are gonna listen to 'em, and it has affected the way...I just seem to be kind of withdrawing and writing more guarded kind of lyrics, not so blunt I guess or whatever.

Dave: You're not opening yourself up as much, or...

Conor: Yeah, I guess I catch myself writing lines and then like kind of rewriting them to be a little more like just kind of...

Dave: Ambiguous?

Conor: Not ambiguous, 'cause I think ambiguity is a big downfall in song writing a lot of times, but I guess more just like a little bit less directed towards myself and more kind of trying to see it from a universal standpoint, which I think is a good thing for my song writing 'cause a lot of my records are really sort of self-absorbed, and that's maybe to the benefit sometimes, but I don't know, I think it's good just to always be changing. For now, I feel like I want to kind of step back and see it a little bit wider perspective, you know.

Dave: Yeah. Along those lines, you started very young doing music, and especially putting out records. Has this been a good route for you, or do you wish that you had started a little later, especially putting stuff out?

Conor: It's been like a blessing and a whatever, a curse I guess, because pretty much every terrible song I've ever written is on either like a tape, like some of my friends have or like even worse, like CD's that a bunch of people have, you know, and it's like it can be embarrassing 'cause I didn't really get that time to like grow too much before I started putting stuff out, you know. And so in that sense, it's kind of weird, but I think also, I don't know, I guess I'm okay with how it worked out just because the more...you know, it's like practice makes perfect. Like, I've made a lot of records now, and I'm gonna make a lot more, and hopefully, at least to myself, I hope that they'll keep improving, at least for myself. Maybe the people that like some of the older ones won't like the new ones, but that's always gonna be the case, you know. It's just like you have to continue to make yourself happy with what you're doing, and I think I'll be able to do that, you know.

Dave: Yeah. Is there any of your songs where a specific part of one of them is like a musical reference to another band or one of your influences?

Conor: Yeah. I mean, there's a lot of sort of exchanging of themes and lyrics and ideas between like me and mostly my friends like Tim Casher, who is a songwriter for Cursive and the Good Life, these bands, he's also like my roommate and one of my biggest influences in general. We oftentimes will have sort of exchanges between the lyrics in my song to his song. Same thing with Ted, who's playing with us tonight, he was a singer in this band Lullaby for the Working Class, and a songwriter forever. Same with this guy Todd who plays in the Faint. It's like sort of all of our group of friends, as well as this band Sun Ambulance that we just put out this split with, that's another one of my best friends, Joe Knapp, and all of us I guess sort of share, I mean, we grew up together and we live in the same town and we are all kind of dealing with the same things, and a lot of times it's almost...in a couple of instances, it's almost been like a conversation between one of my songs and one of their songs and back and forth, and I think it's really cool. I mean, it might be weird if it was strangers, but since it's our friends, it's really natural and it's nice.

Dave: Like which song specifically goes from one, like what song of theirs and what song of yours has that happened?

Conor: I'm trying to think off the top of my head. I know there's a ____________ song, Something Vague, which is like, I don't know, it's on Fevers and Mirrors, and towards the end it's talking about hanging like a star, and basically it's a reference to this...______________ had a record called Such Blinding Stars for Starving Eyes, and in part I'm singing. In the song it sort of sounds like I'm singing about myself, but really I'm sort of singing about Tim and like what I think that he is to other people in a way, sort of a beacon of like truth somehow, or at least what he's been to me, and when it talks about the ghost following us both, it's like, I guess there's like a sort of a bond between his song writing and my song writing as well as the rest of our friends that I think comes across. There's tons of more examples. I just can't think of 'em right now 'cause I'm in the basement of the Bluebird with a ___________ playing upstairs trying to think real fast, but I guess, that's one that comes to my mind.

Dave: Okay, if one comes to mind, just tell me. Do you find that independent media to be a vital counterculture, or do you find it to be no different from the major label machine and major press?

Conor: I have pretty mixed emotions about that because I think that in a lot of ways it is a very vital thing to have press and opinions that are separate from the mainstream and that can actually speak for a faction of the population that is otherwise silent, you know, and that's definitely a positive. I don't know, I run into a lot of sort of fanzines and stuff traveling and playing shows, and some of 'em are just as sort of trite and gossipy and just not really based on anything that really needs to be read anyway, just as a lot of like the main media is too, and I think for both, there's quality mass media out there, you know. I mean, there's NPR, there's things that are obviously a higher standard than like Entertainment Tonight or something like that, and I would say the same for counterculture stuff, you know. There's some really great things and there's some stuff that isn't as great and even sometimes the bottom of the barrel because there's really no one...I support anyone writing anything that they want to write and just getting it into as many hands as possible, 'cause I think that's how you....I think that makes the most richness in like culture in general, you know. So I approve of all that. I just think that hopefully intelligent readers can sift through it and find the stuff that's good, that's quality, and ignore the bullshit, because that's the only way you're gonna get to the decent stuff, so...

Dave: Yeah, absolutely. Do you want to stay indy, or would you entertain the idea of signing to a bigger label?

Conor: I've entertained the idea I guess because that stuff has sort of been thrown in front of us, and obviously you're bound to think about it, you know, you think about the money, you think about maybe the advantages there might be, but in the end, it's something I don't see myself ever doing or maybe not for a really long time, just because I think that we have with Saddle Creek is like really unique and it's something that we've built to this point, and now would be the really most inappropriate time to leave because it's like finally things are working out, you know. It's like we're actually going on good tours and we're selling records and we're doing it all on like our own terms by ourselves, and it's like, why would you give that up now when you've got a good thing going, you know. I mean, maybe I won't always feel that way. I definitely don't think ill of any band that decides to sign to a major. I just think it works for some people, but a lot of people, a lot of friends of mine have gotten totally fucked over by doing that, and I'm really weary of that.

Dave: How so? What kinds of things have happened to them?

Conor: Well, the band that comes to mind right away is friends of mine, this band Spoon from Austin, Texas. Now they've put out records for Matador, they just put out a record on Merge, they're a great band, they went through a terrible time. They put out one record on Electra. Basically they signed, they had all these high hopes, and something sort of snapped in the Electra mastermind or whatever, and they decided that this isn't gonna sell, and basically they never even promoted their record. More or less didn't really even release it, and so now you have this great record they've made that no one's ever gonna hear, and they just went through all this hassle and all these lawyers involved and it just seems like at that point, it's so far from like what was good about music to being with and why you're doing it, which is to put out music. I mean, hopefully making a living, I don't think that's bad at all. If you can make a living doing it, awesome, keep doing it. But really you want to just build and make your music and share it with people and do what you do like on a way that can be sustained, you know, for a long period of time. I mean, that's the way I look at it. As long as I have enough resources to keep going and keep doing what I want to do and whatever, eat, and have a van that can drive around, then that's great. I mean, that's why we're doing it.

Dave: Cool. That's about it. If you wouldn't mind, I'd like to get an i.d.